Over the last century, the Land of the Free has slowly transformed into a land governed by endless laws, largely by cracking down on vices instead of actual crimes, creating a society that would render us all criminals if our behavior were constantly observed. Meanwhile, the state has steadily expanded its use of mass surveillance, largely under the pretext of fighting “terror.”
This is a toxic mixture.
This is already a concerning power to hand to a government, which could cause issues regarding the right of freedom of movement. But even if we assume an ideal and responsible government that never misuses their powers, can we be sure such a backdoor would be secure enough not to be exploited by other parties?
I see where they’re coming from, but like every good idea the government has had its going to be abused and mutated into Satan’s Christmas tree of a bill, and either be draconian or useless.
Autostart stop. It’s a “feature” of newer gasoline vehicles that allows them to save gas by shutting the engine off when you’re idling (at a stop light or similar) until you touch the throttle/gas pedal and the computer reactivates the engine. This assumes there isn’t significant load on the battery like there would be if you were using your heat/AC or even the radio.
Oh, sorry. American cars are require to ship with a feature that shuts the engine off at stop lights, and restarts it when you take your foot off the brake. It’s done to supposedly help the environment, which it doesn’t do in the least and is also incredibly irritating.
So car hackers reconfigure their cars to disable that feature.
It’s a small sample size, but literally everyone I know that owns a car with that feature turns it off immediately after starting the car every time they get in it.
It’s not explicitly required by law, but that doesn’t make it any less mandatory. It’s one of those “we’re not saying you have to, we’re just saying we’ll beat you up if you don’t” rules federal agencies (EPA, in this case) love so much.
Car and Driver explains some of the reasoning here, though they forget to mention efficiency standards that are explicitly mandated.
Not all American cars have this. We literally just bought a Honda Civic and it doesn’t have auto stop start. That’s not to mention hybrids and electric cars. It’s implemented by car manufacturers as far as I can tell in order to meet gas efficiency requirements of the NHTSA and it’s mostly for larger consumer vehicles. SUV’s, and trucks, not your average sedan. I don’t think you represented this very well in your first comment.
I sure hope I never get injured using my chainsaw out in the forest with no cell service. It’s going to be so awesome bleeding out in a truck that cuts to 5mph max because I’m too busy holding the tourniquet on my leg while I drive. That’s certainly NEVER happened. NEVER happens, to nobody, including my mother.
Wild that’s exactly what happened to one of my professors. He like to log for a side gig (dunno why) and nearly chopped his leg off with his chainsaw and had to hold his leg together while he hauled ass to the hospital.
Holy shit, I just realized the true problem! We need to make chainsaws illegal to own, operate, and manufacture. Just look at the statistics. Oh my God, I am the human that figured it out! Make chainsaws illegal!
So this isn’t an external kill switch. It’s far more likely to be a lane and driver monitoring system integral to the car itself.
The big problem is what do you do with a car that’s stopped itself? Obviously you need emergency services, and obviously you can’t depend on the passengers to call them. So the real effect here is to mandate the integration of vehicles into the emergency service networks so the car can call up dispatch.
I would say this is another brick in the argument for an open source car operating system that keeps the car offline and gives you the tools you want.
I would say this is another brick in the argument for an open source car operating system
…Go analog with a carb, maybe? Only thing that can stop a carb from working is it being out of gas. Or changing altitude. Or bad fuel. Or it’s too cold and/or hot. … OK lots of things can stop carbs, but the government sure can’t, at least.
Don’t have time right now the deep dive into that absolute wall of text. Did get a few paragraphs in to find that your champion is Thomas Massie ® (Nut Job), that’s clarity enough for now…
All around the world when the police sees you speeding in a school zone and you don’t stop they won’t go and speed in a school zone as well. But we also don’t sell guns in supermarkets and later have a problem with gun violence.
What I said was why would someone that plans to commit a crime have a license plate? Since they just have to not stop and the police can’t do anything if they can’t chase.
Chasing sucks, I 100% agree it’s a terrible solution. But what other solution is there that can be implemented? Please come up with one so that we can actually do away with chasing. Somebody work on this problem.
You’re saying, cops shouldn’t chase cars. What would happen next if they can’t chase cars? They already have all kinds of rules for breaking it off for safety. And they keep making more. If there was a better solution, they would be all for it. In alot of cases, backing off can decrease safety for a bit too, so they have to be careful when they stop chasing too. The lights and sirens help keep people safer around the speeding car.
It’s not an easy problem, there is no easy solution. It’ll keep evolving as small solutions for parts of what sucks about it are thought of.
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This is already a concerning power to hand to a government, which could cause issues regarding the right of freedom of movement. But even if we assume an ideal and responsible government that never misuses their powers, can we be sure such a backdoor would be secure enough not to be exploited by other parties?
Next step will be to have it drive you to the police station and alert them of your arrival.
I remember when a remote kill switch was the unlikely yet dystopian “next step”
I see where they’re coming from, but like every good idea the government has had its going to be abused and mutated into Satan’s Christmas tree of a bill, and either be draconian or useless.
Also, this idea is shit for brains stupid lol
Can’t wait to patch that out, should be as fun as that dumbshit auto-shutoff they have now.
?
Autostart stop. It’s a “feature” of newer gasoline vehicles that allows them to save gas by shutting the engine off when you’re idling (at a stop light or similar) until you touch the throttle/gas pedal and the computer reactivates the engine. This assumes there isn’t significant load on the battery like there would be if you were using your heat/AC or even the radio.
Cars are computers. All those fancy features run on software. Software can be patched to get rid of unpleasant functionality.
It’s not always easy, but it’s doable, and the more of these stupid features they add, the more people spend time working on undoing them.
I was wondering more about the auto shutoff.
Oh, sorry. American cars are require to ship with a feature that shuts the engine off at stop lights, and restarts it when you take your foot off the brake. It’s done to supposedly help the environment, which it doesn’t do in the least and is also incredibly irritating.
So car hackers reconfigure their cars to disable that feature.
Got some studies for that? Cause everything I’ve seen suggested that FAS, forced auto-stop, does help.
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It only helps when people leave it on.
It’s a small sample size, but literally everyone I know that owns a car with that feature turns it off immediately after starting the car every time they get in it.
Can you show me the law that states auto start stop is a requirement?
It’s not explicitly required by law, but that doesn’t make it any less mandatory. It’s one of those “we’re not saying you have to, we’re just saying we’ll beat you up if you don’t” rules federal agencies (EPA, in this case) love so much.
Car and Driver explains some of the reasoning here, though they forget to mention efficiency standards that are explicitly mandated.
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a19561461/automakers-increasingly-offer-ways-to-deactivate-stopstart-systems-temporarily/
Not all American cars have this. We literally just bought a Honda Civic and it doesn’t have auto stop start. That’s not to mention hybrids and electric cars. It’s implemented by car manufacturers as far as I can tell in order to meet gas efficiency requirements of the NHTSA and it’s mostly for larger consumer vehicles. SUV’s, and trucks, not your average sedan. I don’t think you represented this very well in your first comment.
I sure hope I never get injured using my chainsaw out in the forest with no cell service. It’s going to be so awesome bleeding out in a truck that cuts to 5mph max because I’m too busy holding the tourniquet on my leg while I drive. That’s certainly NEVER happened. NEVER happens, to nobody, including my mother.
Wild that’s exactly what happened to one of my professors. He like to log for a side gig (dunno why) and nearly chopped his leg off with his chainsaw and had to hold his leg together while he hauled ass to the hospital.
Yup. Quick slip is all it takes. My mom and plenty of other people have had it happen.
Holy shit, I just realized the true problem! We need to make chainsaws illegal to own, operate, and manufacture. Just look at the statistics. Oh my God, I am the human that figured it out! Make chainsaws illegal!
First part to get ripped out of new cars
I’m sure we’ll never find out that the kill switch was disproportionately used on people of color.
So this isn’t an external kill switch. It’s far more likely to be a lane and driver monitoring system integral to the car itself.
The big problem is what do you do with a car that’s stopped itself? Obviously you need emergency services, and obviously you can’t depend on the passengers to call them. So the real effect here is to mandate the integration of vehicles into the emergency service networks so the car can call up dispatch.
I would say this is another brick in the argument for an open source car operating system that keeps the car offline and gives you the tools you want.
Do you think that last sentence will ever happen though? I’d be stoked if it did, but the cynical side of me says we’re already doomed…
Not outside of a niche group with the skills to do it themselves.
Yeah, that’s kind of what I think too. Maybe someone will figure out how to jailbreak, like another commenter suggested.
Jailbreaking cars will be the new software development in piracy. Just wait for someone to figure out a way to permanently disable this entire system.
I would jailbreak my vehicle’s head unit SOFAST!!!
…Go analog with a carb, maybe? Only thing that can stop a carb from working is it being out of gas. Or changing altitude. Or bad fuel. Or it’s too cold and/or hot. … OK lots of things can stop carbs, but the government sure can’t, at least.
clogged jets… lol
That’s what the Seagram is for, probably.
Nixon thought he could, hence the war on drugs.
Don’t have time right now the deep dive into that absolute wall of text. Did get a few paragraphs in to find that your champion is Thomas Massie ® (Nut Job), that’s clarity enough for now…
I’m just waiting for the moment that this kill switch is hacked, and whole cities come to a complete standstill.
Please stop…I can only get so erect
American solution to a problem of deadly car chases.
I guess „don’t chase cars” would be too simple.
So any crime committed while in a car is free-game? No need for license plates, just buy a generic looking car and never stop.
You just said license plates dude.
All around the world when the police sees you speeding in a school zone and you don’t stop they won’t go and speed in a school zone as well. But we also don’t sell guns in supermarkets and later have a problem with gun violence.
What I said was why would someone that plans to commit a crime have a license plate? Since they just have to not stop and the police can’t do anything if they can’t chase.
Chasing sucks, I 100% agree it’s a terrible solution. But what other solution is there that can be implemented? Please come up with one so that we can actually do away with chasing. Somebody work on this problem.
You’re saying, cops shouldn’t chase cars. What would happen next if they can’t chase cars? They already have all kinds of rules for breaking it off for safety. And they keep making more. If there was a better solution, they would be all for it. In alot of cases, backing off can decrease safety for a bit too, so they have to be careful when they stop chasing too. The lights and sirens help keep people safer around the speeding car.
It’s not an easy problem, there is no easy solution. It’ll keep evolving as small solutions for parts of what sucks about it are thought of.