The EU's Digital Market Act prohibits Apple and other tech giants from favoring their own systems.
The long fight to make Apple’s iMessage compatible with all devices has raged with little to show for it. But Google (de facto leader of the charge) and other mobile operators are now leveraging the European Union’s Digital Market Act (DMA), according to the Financial Times. The law, which goes into effect in 2024, requires that “gatekeepers” not favor their own systems or limit third parties from interoperating within them. Gatekeepers are any company that meets specific financial and usage qualifications, including Google’s parent company Alphabet, Apple, Samsung and others.
finally!! i’ve seen how google has been treating the situation with apple and i kind of think apple does have a bit of dislike-bias for android because it’s open source and linux. well, i hope apple stops the green message bubble feature.
All I want is to be able to message people using discord through Signal. Or from Messages to Whatsapp. And just be able to send and receive decent quality videos between iMessage and non-imessage users.
It’s so annoying having to juggle so many different messaging apps just to talk to people.
Just thought it was worth clarifying since a lot of people treat RCS and Google Messages like the same thing when one is a Google product (Google Messages) and the other is an open standard (RCS)
Google Messages is built on RCS but if Apple wanted interoperability they would only need to support the open standard (RCS) not use any of Google’s code or require Google’s permission.
Nobody in EU uses SMS, it stopped being a thing as soon as everyone had phones with internet and you could use better chat apps. So we don’t give a crap about iMessage being open or not.
My understanding is that while the US and some others quickly moved to unlimited texting plans, many European countries continued to charge per text so apps like WhatsApp become the defacto replacement
As much as I have been on the EU’s side on every case that they’ve had against Apple. This should be a giant red flag that Google is pushing this so hard.
I get that this is a silly issue that only a subset of Americans actually care about, but if you think that Google is doing this for any other reason other than that they don’t like how popular iMessage is and want it to end, you’re fooling yourself. Google hopes to eventually make more money when one barrier between an Android and iPhone is removed.
SMS is an ancient garbage protocol, what Google is trying to do is get Apple to support SMSs 21st century replacement, RCS
But Apple doesn’t want that because RCS support will fix literally every issue iPhone users have texting Android users. Broken group chats, trash quality videos, ultra compressed images, no reactions or stickers, threaded chats etc etc
Specifically Googles implementation is a replacement, but then it’s the exact same situation we’re in now, just with Google instead of Apple.
No, because I can dig up official documentation for googles implementation. Where’s Apples iMessage documentation?
RCS is a replacement for SMS, it was intended for carriers to implement it as is standard in the EU. In the US however, the carriers have infamously resisted calls to get off their ass and implement it. Even Google was calling on carriers to do it for years, they only came out with their Jibe platform because the carriers weren’t doing their jobs
Does documentation matter if it’s still a closed platform? Imo it doesn’t.
RCS requiring 3rd party servers makes it not a replacement for sms. SMS is a very well thought out protocol that works exactly as intended, it just doesn’t have the bandwidth required for modern media.
Google can call on carriers all they want. It’s still a proprietary google implementation which is no better than Apple. And I trust Apple a hell of a lot more than google (which still isn’t a lot).
Yes, because documentation as I’m referencing it is for accessing the API. You can’t access iMessages API (Well without serious reverse engineering effort) so therefore they have no documentation
RCS is a standard, Google has it’s flavor and Apple could just as easily have their own or any other flavor.
SMS is antiquated and should be used for nothing more than a fallback at best. It’s 30+ years old.
I still don’t see that as any different. Apple has a proprietary implementation, google has an proprietary implementation. You like google because they have documentation. Neither is an open platform, yet you seem to be pushing google like it’s the bastion of open communication.
RCS is not standard, will not be standard and should not be standard.
SMS works perfectly fine. So what if it’s 30 years old. It still works exactly as intended.
It doesn’t have to be open, just provide publicly accessible APIs so that apps can interconnect with it. Google provides this, Apple does not.
To be clear IDGAF about Google. I promote RCS and you can say it’s not a standard, but it is. It’s maintained by the GSM Association and they put out a universal profile that anyone can implement and extend just like Google did and Apple could easily do. They’re just extending an existing standard.
Even in the Google messages app I can change the RCS backend servers at any time, you don’t have to use Googles RCS implementation
This feels a bit like asking MS Teams to play nice with Google Meet, or demanding that Apple’s office suite (Pages, Numbers, etc.) deliver the exact same product when files are saved in an OpenOffice format. This doesn’t seem to be an issue with any other products…
Apple have designed their product to work well with their devices. The Messages app still functions with non-Apple devices. SMS messages can be sent and received to anyone. The fact that pictures and whatever come through like crap is more an issue with the SMS platform than it is with Apple’s app.
Ultimately, Google dislikes the fact that there is a “green bubble” stigma (for lack of a better word) on Apple devices that encourages those who care about such things to prefer Apple devices. Because Google doesn’t have their own widely used iMessage equivalent, they can’t turn around and make messages outside their platform appear as red bubbles or something, so they are attacking from this angle instead.
It’s quite literally well documented that Apple doesn’t want to support RCS because it pressures people to get iPhones. SMS is an ancient garbage protocol, what Google is trying to do is get Apple to support SMSs 21st century replacement and RCS support will fix literally every issue iPhone users have texting Android users. Broken group chats, trash quality videos, ultra compressed images, no reactions or stickers, threaded chats etc etc
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The fuck is with all these comments? Since when are we siding with Apple and closed off communications standards around here?
We’re not. Just calling out the hypocrisy of Google.
Since we know Apple is the lesser of 2 evils and Google is a crying baby
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Until Google supports RCS on Google voice, I can’t take their requests seriously.
That’s an interesting point. I have Google voice but I honestly don’t use it much. Are you a big Google voice user?
Yes. But it has “forgotten by Google” energy. It wouldn’t shock me if it joins the Google graveyard.
finally!! i’ve seen how google has been treating the situation with apple and i kind of think apple does have a bit of dislike-bias for android because it’s open source and linux. well, i hope apple stops the green message bubble feature.
All I want is to be able to message people using discord through Signal. Or from Messages to Whatsapp. And just be able to send and receive decent quality videos between iMessage and non-imessage users.
It’s so annoying having to juggle so many different messaging apps just to talk to people.
Why can’t it be like email?
Try Beeper!
Links all those services into one client using Matrix for the backend.
Drop me a DM if you want a referral code (that goes for anyone interested!)
Federated messaging services… this is actually a really cool idea.
But I guess big companies prefer walled gardens because it makes more money.
So Google will reciprocate and open up its RCS platform right? Right? I doubt it.
RCS is an open standard not owned by Google
I meant their closed network for it, not the standard.
Just thought it was worth clarifying since a lot of people treat RCS and Google Messages like the same thing when one is a Google product (Google Messages) and the other is an open standard (RCS)
Google Messages is built on RCS but if Apple wanted interoperability they would only need to support the open standard (RCS) not use any of Google’s code or require Google’s permission.
If this law passes they may very well have to.
Nobody in EU uses SMS, it stopped being a thing as soon as everyone had phones with internet and you could use better chat apps. So we don’t give a crap about iMessage being open or not.
I only just found out this year that text messages from IPhone or Android are a different colour in the US, and people would judge you on that.
Fuckin hell, that’s elementary-school-level behaviour 😂
I use SMS a lot, in the EU. So does, most of my family, and friends. So idk where you get this from? GF and her friends and family too.
My understanding is that while the US and some others quickly moved to unlimited texting plans, many European countries continued to charge per text so apps like WhatsApp become the defacto replacement
In France we got unlimited texts at about the same time as unlimited data.
I don’t think a plan with unlimited data and limited texts ever existed.
You probably use SMS mostly for getting codes
Why?
Because he’s wrong, most people use text in Europe. Even if it’s addition to an app like WhatsApp.
Only if you count receiving verification codes as “Using SMS”. Even my elderly parents only use messaging apps.
I don’t have anyone I contact through SMS.
There are a ton of different page patterns so I don’t think “Everyone” or “No one” is using SMS.
But, in my experience, they are used very very little by most people.
Apple will start selling subscription services to Android platforms including iMessage. It’s just a matter of time.
Good old companies wanting to exploit the law
As much as I have been on the EU’s side on every case that they’ve had against Apple. This should be a giant red flag that Google is pushing this so hard.
I get that this is a silly issue that only a subset of Americans actually care about, but if you think that Google is doing this for any other reason other than that they don’t like how popular iMessage is and want it to end, you’re fooling yourself. Google hopes to eventually make more money when one barrier between an Android and iPhone is removed.
The messages app supports SMS. That means it already “interoperates” with common messaging apps and platforms.
SMS is an ancient garbage protocol, what Google is trying to do is get Apple to support SMSs 21st century replacement, RCS
But Apple doesn’t want that because RCS support will fix literally every issue iPhone users have texting Android users. Broken group chats, trash quality videos, ultra compressed images, no reactions or stickers, threaded chats etc etc
RCS as a standard isn’t a replacement. RCS as a base project is dead.
Specifically Googles implementation is a replacement, but then it’s the exact same situation we’re in now, just with Google instead of Apple.
No, because I can dig up official documentation for googles implementation. Where’s Apples iMessage documentation?
RCS is a replacement for SMS, it was intended for carriers to implement it as is standard in the EU. In the US however, the carriers have infamously resisted calls to get off their ass and implement it. Even Google was calling on carriers to do it for years, they only came out with their Jibe platform because the carriers weren’t doing their jobs
Does documentation matter if it’s still a closed platform? Imo it doesn’t.
RCS requiring 3rd party servers makes it not a replacement for sms. SMS is a very well thought out protocol that works exactly as intended, it just doesn’t have the bandwidth required for modern media.
Google can call on carriers all they want. It’s still a proprietary google implementation which is no better than Apple. And I trust Apple a hell of a lot more than google (which still isn’t a lot).
Yes, because documentation as I’m referencing it is for accessing the API. You can’t access iMessages API (Well without serious reverse engineering effort) so therefore they have no documentation
RCS is a standard, Google has it’s flavor and Apple could just as easily have their own or any other flavor.
SMS is antiquated and should be used for nothing more than a fallback at best. It’s 30+ years old.
I still don’t see that as any different. Apple has a proprietary implementation, google has an proprietary implementation. You like google because they have documentation. Neither is an open platform, yet you seem to be pushing google like it’s the bastion of open communication.
RCS is not standard, will not be standard and should not be standard.
SMS works perfectly fine. So what if it’s 30 years old. It still works exactly as intended.
It doesn’t have to be open, just provide publicly accessible APIs so that apps can interconnect with it. Google provides this, Apple does not.
To be clear IDGAF about Google. I promote RCS and you can say it’s not a standard, but it is. It’s maintained by the GSM Association and they put out a universal profile that anyone can implement and extend just like Google did and Apple could easily do. They’re just extending an existing standard.
Even in the Google messages app I can change the RCS backend servers at any time, you don’t have to use Googles RCS implementation
This feels a bit like asking MS Teams to play nice with Google Meet, or demanding that Apple’s office suite (Pages, Numbers, etc.) deliver the exact same product when files are saved in an OpenOffice format. This doesn’t seem to be an issue with any other products…
Apple have designed their product to work well with their devices. The Messages app still functions with non-Apple devices. SMS messages can be sent and received to anyone. The fact that pictures and whatever come through like crap is more an issue with the SMS platform than it is with Apple’s app.
Ultimately, Google dislikes the fact that there is a “green bubble” stigma (for lack of a better word) on Apple devices that encourages those who care about such things to prefer Apple devices. Because Google doesn’t have their own widely used iMessage equivalent, they can’t turn around and make messages outside their platform appear as red bubbles or something, so they are attacking from this angle instead.
Sent from my iPhone
It’s quite literally well documented that Apple doesn’t want to support RCS because it pressures people to get iPhones. SMS is an ancient garbage protocol, what Google is trying to do is get Apple to support SMSs 21st century replacement and RCS support will fix literally every issue iPhone users have texting Android users. Broken group chats, trash quality videos, ultra compressed images, no reactions or stickers, threaded chats etc etc
That’s hilarious
They’re not joking. They use iPhone.
Legitimately can’t tell if you’re joking or not.
Google is so fucking pathetic these days. They can’t out program them so they cry to the EU instead