As humanity’s furthest reach into the Universe so far, the two Voyager spacecraft’s well-being is of utmost importance to many. Although we know that there will be an end to any science…
It is just incredible to me that we have the ability and knowhow to send instructions to a 40 year old transistor computer to reprogram itself and get it working again with just radio signals.
With no way to fix the chip, the team instead split the code up so it could be stored elsewhere. Initially they focused on reacquiring the engineering data, sending an update to Voyager 1 on 18 April 2024.
It takes 22.5 hours for a radio signal to travel the 24 billion kilometres (15 billion miles) out to Voyager 1, and the same back, meaning the spacecraft’s operations team didn’t receive a message back until 20 April.
But when it arrived, they had usable data from Voyager 1 for the first time in five months.
Here’s a fun fact that I think of every time I read about light delay.
We assume the speed of light is the same in all directions but there’s no way to prove that it is.
It could be light speed is instantaneous in one direction, and half the speed we think it is in the reverse. Any test we could devise depends on information traveling in two directions, nullifying any discrepancies in light speed.
The speed of light in a vacuum unaffected by external forces such as gravity should be the same no matter what direction it is in. I’m not sure why it wouldn’t be. That’s like saying a kilometer is longer if you go East than if you go West.
However, it’s actually far more complicated than that, and much of it beyond my understanding.
Incredible is the right word, how does this still work after more than 47 years? How do they even still have energy to send and receive signals? That’s one heck of a durable power source. How do the computers and sensors still work? The reliability and durability of these probes is amazing. NASA truly had some reality wizards doing what seems like magic to accomplish this.
Either that or, aliens have been helping out and repaired it from time to time.
How do they even still have energy to send and receive signals? That’s one heck of a durable power source.
It’s literally decaying plutonium-238. And because it decays, it’s putting out less power than when it started. They’ve shut down certain operations to conserve power, and obviously prioritize things like communication back to earth.
Yes the data is valuable for research. You and I may not understand any of it, but its useful to someone.
As for repairing from a distance, that thing has been traveling for 46 years and gone far. For reference, it passed Neptune back in 1989.
It would take many years for a new probe to reach those distances, so if it can be repaired, it shall.
Hypothetically, lets say it only takes 30 years for a new probe with updated tech to reach where Voyager 2 is now. If V2 died today, thats half of someone’s career spent waiting for the new probe to arrive. Multiply that by everyone using the probe for research and you have a ton of wasted potential.
I’m aware that sending something to do the repairs isn’t an option, my question was whether it’s worth it (and apparently it is) or if it’s more an experiment about long distance repairs which by itself is very expressive already.
I’m not sure why I’m downvoted. Maybe I worded my question badly or it’s because it was a question I could have googled on my own. I don’t know and neither do I care. I don’t think you downvoted me, if it sounded that way. Just now saw it and wondered why
Remote software repairs are definatly good, pretty cool and worth bragging about. If you have to do a physical repair, you’re probably better off just sending a new probe [citation needed], but as I said the time investment is huge.
It is a legitimate question, however the way it was asked has a negative vibe, intentional or not. You pretty much gave a good option and bad option and said “pick one” - generally when that’s asked, we assume the asker assumes the negative is true (it’s hard to explain). To me, it could be interpreted as “just curious, I assume this probe is only taking pretty pictures, so why do you bother repairing it?”.
Personally, I’ve been trying to avoid jumping to those types of conclusions, but its not easy.
Text has no tone, and phrases sometimes have a secondary tonal meanings that people will insert. “Just curious…was it you that didn’t refill the coffee machine this morning?”
Thanks, I’m not good at tone in my native language already and even less in English. I didn’t give the comment much thought, I could have found a better phrasing.
About the coffee machine: I refilled it today so it must have been someone else who didn’t
So some years ago, the probe went into some area between our solar system and interstellar space. Getting info back about that is quite useful in learning more about that area.
I’m not sure if its through it yet, but if it is, then we’re getting data back about what’s after that as well. Does that data change over time? What if there’s yet another transition area and we learn about it?
Having something actually there helps us know if all these theories are right, and the more data we get, the more sure we can be
Out past the planets is the heliopause, the final boundary between the solar system and interstellar space. Voyager discovered it, but other probes have confirmed it. The radiation and particles emitted by the sun create a pressurized bubble around it, where plasma (energized particles, mostly hydrogen) is much denser than past the heliopause. Cosmic rays are more prevalent outside it.
I’ve heard it compared to the empty zone around where a sink faucet first hits, creating a little “wall” of water around it as the splashing water pushes back the standing water.
“Empty” space is anything but. There’s tons of particles and energy flying though it, just not as dense.
Voyager 2 went with a different trajectory specifically to fly by the outer planets. Voyager 1 went with a more aggressive gravity assist from both Jupiter and Saturn to gain the speed necessary to leave the solar system. So it’s not only that it takes decades to get that far, but also the launch window of when different planets are aligned to make the mission feasible.
There are currently five science investigation teams participating in the VIM. The science teams for these investigations are currently collecting and evaluating data on the strength and orientation of the Sun’s magnetic field; the composition, direction and energy spectra of the solar wind particles and interstellar cosmic rays; the strength of radio emissions that are thought to be originating at the heliopause, beyond which is interstellar space; and the distribution of hydrogen within the outer heliosphere.
There are 4 operating instruments on-board the Voyager 1 spacecraft. These instruments directly support the five science investigations teams. The Planetary Radio Astronomy Investigation (PRA) is no longer working on the Voyager 1 spacecraft and the Ultraviolet Spectrometer Subsystem (UVS) is no longer working on Voyager 1 or Voyager 2.
Considering that’s one of the two objects humanity ever have on direct contact with the medium outside the limits of our solar system, and the only tool we’ll have there for at least four decades, I’d argue that yes, it is pretty valuable.
The repair from distance part is nothing to be shy about, too.
Kinda goes against capitalism. Planned obsolescence has been around for a long time and if somebody goes against it, they will be removed by the big players.
I’m not saying planned obsolescence isn’t a thing (because it is), but that’s not the only reason. Making phones smaller, lighter, faster, and more feature-dense all mean that the phone has to be built with tighter manufacturing and operating tolerances. Faster chips are more prone to heat and vibration damage. Higher power requirements means the battery has a larger charge/discharge cycle. And unfortunately, tighter operating tolerances mean that they can fall out of those tolerances much more easily.
They get dropped, shaken, exposed to large environmental temperature swings, charged in wonky ways, exposed to hand oils and other kinds of dirt, and a slew of other evils. Older phones that didn’t have such tight tolerances could handle all that better. Old Nokia phones weren’t built to be indestructible, they are just such simple phones that there isn’t much to break; but there’s a reason people don’t use them much anymore. You can still get simple feature phones, but the fact remains that they don’t sell well, so not many are made, and the ones that are made don’t have a lot of time and money invested in them.
Now Voyager is an extremely simple computer, made with technology that has huge tolerances, in an environment that is mostly consistent and known ahead of time so the design can deliberately account for it, had lots of testing, didn’t have to take mass production into its design consideration, didn’t have to make cost trade-offs, and has a dedicated engineering team to keep it going. It is still impressive that it has lasted this long, but that is more a testament to the incredible work that was and is being put into it than to the technology behind it.
I cant even get a decent wifi signal from a router 15ft away from me, but somehow we’re sending and receiving data from a satellite, that’s practically outside of our solar system. Isn’t that wild?
Anyone ever sometimes think, that there’s an alien species that kinda feels a little paternal towards us and keeps fixing out Tonka Toys because it makes us happy?
Screw thanking aliens, it’s an incredible team of engineers that have the skills and dedication to do what seems impossible. This was 100% humanity at its best.
They rebuilt the most critical core code on a near antique spacecraft that has effectively left the solar system over an equally ancient radio link. They had 1 shot, and nailed it.
Yes ra ra NASA is totally legit and a shining example of the best achievements of humanity for sure. Nothing sketchy about it. It is amazing though to think how manned space flight is the only technology to not only lack progress in the last 60 years, but has actually regressed. I really wish these hero scientists could get back to working on manned space flight so we can ditch this whirling spaceball
Exactly. If there’s anything that we can point to and say “humanity, fuck yeah” this is it. Giving thanks to aliens or to gods is an insult to the hard work of the HUMANS that accomplished this.
Exactly. NASA has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that there is no God, the earth is a ball, we can trust our governments and large institutions, and manned space flight was a '70s trend back when the economy was better. We still have them to thank for Velcro and Tang my dudes
This is disrespectful towards the achievements of the human race. My father kept attributing all of our recent technology to “the findings at roswell” and i have very strong feelings towards this position.
So much agreeance. I can see how people may be awestruck by recent technology, but crediting it to extraterrestrial life both completely ignores the gradual progression of knowledge which enabled it and disregards the brilliant minds who spent their lives bringing it to fruition.
Provided we engineer them well, this is good news for truly deep space operations. Cosmic radiation and interplanetary gasses could (and probably do) wreak havoc on various materials, but apparently technology from the 70s is capable of handling it very long term.
Now if we could just get out of these squishy meat suits we’d be in business.
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It’s like the Jason Vorhees of spacecraft
That’s just Jason X.
That’s far out!
It is just incredible to me that we have the ability and knowhow to send instructions to a 40 year old transistor computer to reprogram itself and get it working again with just radio signals.
47 year old probe. Damn near 50
…from 15.2 BILLION miles away.
And it can reply by basically shining a (very high-frequency) flashlight back at us.
What they did was close to wizardry.
https://www.skyatnightmagazine.com/space-missions/how-fixed-voyager-1
Here’s a fun fact that I think of every time I read about light delay.
We assume the speed of light is the same in all directions but there’s no way to prove that it is.
It could be light speed is instantaneous in one direction, and half the speed we think it is in the reverse. Any test we could devise depends on information traveling in two directions, nullifying any discrepancies in light speed.
The speed of light in a vacuum unaffected by external forces such as gravity should be the same no matter what direction it is in. I’m not sure why it wouldn’t be. That’s like saying a kilometer is longer if you go East than if you go West.
However, it’s actually far more complicated than that, and much of it beyond my understanding.
https://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/physics/Relativity/SpeedOfLight/speed_of_light.html
That said, direction should not matter.
Incredible is the right word, how does this still work after more than 47 years? How do they even still have energy to send and receive signals? That’s one heck of a durable power source. How do the computers and sensors still work? The reliability and durability of these probes is amazing. NASA truly had some reality wizards doing what seems like magic to accomplish this.
Either that or, aliens have been helping out and repaired it from time to time.
Fuck aliens
It’s literally decaying plutonium-238. And because it decays, it’s putting out less power than when it started. They’ve shut down certain operations to conserve power, and obviously prioritize things like communication back to earth.
Nuclear power, it packs a punch!
V’ger has evolved
I was looking for this comment, else I would have been very disappointed
Live Long and Prosper
Just curious: is the data of value for research or is it more like “look at us, we can repair from a distance”?
Yes the data is valuable for research. You and I may not understand any of it, but its useful to someone. As for repairing from a distance, that thing has been traveling for 46 years and gone far. For reference, it passed Neptune back in 1989.
It would take many years for a new probe to reach those distances, so if it can be repaired, it shall.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voyager_2
Hypothetically, lets say it only takes 30 years for a new probe with updated tech to reach where Voyager 2 is now. If V2 died today, thats half of someone’s career spent waiting for the new probe to arrive. Multiply that by everyone using the probe for research and you have a ton of wasted potential.
I’m aware that sending something to do the repairs isn’t an option, my question was whether it’s worth it (and apparently it is) or if it’s more an experiment about long distance repairs which by itself is very expressive already.
I’m not sure why I’m downvoted. Maybe I worded my question badly or it’s because it was a question I could have googled on my own. I don’t know and neither do I care. I don’t think you downvoted me, if it sounded that way. Just now saw it and wondered why
Remote software repairs are definatly good, pretty cool and worth bragging about. If you have to do a physical repair, you’re probably better off just sending a new probe [citation needed], but as I said the time investment is huge.
It is a legitimate question, however the way it was asked has a negative vibe, intentional or not. You pretty much gave a good option and bad option and said “pick one” - generally when that’s asked, we assume the asker assumes the negative is true (it’s hard to explain). To me, it could be interpreted as “just curious, I assume this probe is only taking pretty pictures, so why do you bother repairing it?”.
Personally, I’ve been trying to avoid jumping to those types of conclusions, but its not easy. Text has no tone, and phrases sometimes have a secondary tonal meanings that people will insert. “Just curious…was it you that didn’t refill the coffee machine this morning?”
Thanks, I’m not good at tone in my native language already and even less in English. I didn’t give the comment much thought, I could have found a better phrasing.
About the coffee machine: I refilled it today so it must have been someone else who didn’t
So some years ago, the probe went into some area between our solar system and interstellar space. Getting info back about that is quite useful in learning more about that area.
I’m not sure if its through it yet, but if it is, then we’re getting data back about what’s after that as well. Does that data change over time? What if there’s yet another transition area and we learn about it?
Having something actually there helps us know if all these theories are right, and the more data we get, the more sure we can be
How is there space between the solar system and interstellar space? Isn’t interstellar just everything between the star systems?
The solar winds interact with interstellar winds and create a threshold between the two
https://voyager.jpl.nasa.gov/news/details.php?article_id=14
Out past the planets is the heliopause, the final boundary between the solar system and interstellar space. Voyager discovered it, but other probes have confirmed it. The radiation and particles emitted by the sun create a pressurized bubble around it, where plasma (energized particles, mostly hydrogen) is much denser than past the heliopause. Cosmic rays are more prevalent outside it.
I’ve heard it compared to the empty zone around where a sink faucet first hits, creating a little “wall” of water around it as the splashing water pushes back the standing water.
“Empty” space is anything but. There’s tons of particles and energy flying though it, just not as dense.
That sink analogy is great. It’s even non uniform like the heliopause
Voyager 2 went with a different trajectory specifically to fly by the outer planets. Voyager 1 went with a more aggressive gravity assist from both Jupiter and Saturn to gain the speed necessary to leave the solar system. So it’s not only that it takes decades to get that far, but also the launch window of when different planets are aligned to make the mission feasible.
https://voyager.jpl.nasa.gov/mission/science/
Considering that’s one of the two objects humanity ever have on direct contact with the medium outside the limits of our solar system, and the only tool we’ll have there for at least four decades, I’d argue that yes, it is pretty valuable.
The repair from distance part is nothing to be shy about, too.
o7
I’m constantly amazed at the longevity of this probe, so awesome!
it’s too bad they don’t make cellphones like this
Kinda goes against capitalism. Planned obsolescence has been around for a long time and if somebody goes against it, they will be removed by the big players.
I’m not saying planned obsolescence isn’t a thing (because it is), but that’s not the only reason. Making phones smaller, lighter, faster, and more feature-dense all mean that the phone has to be built with tighter manufacturing and operating tolerances. Faster chips are more prone to heat and vibration damage. Higher power requirements means the battery has a larger charge/discharge cycle. And unfortunately, tighter operating tolerances mean that they can fall out of those tolerances much more easily.
They get dropped, shaken, exposed to large environmental temperature swings, charged in wonky ways, exposed to hand oils and other kinds of dirt, and a slew of other evils. Older phones that didn’t have such tight tolerances could handle all that better. Old Nokia phones weren’t built to be indestructible, they are just such simple phones that there isn’t much to break; but there’s a reason people don’t use them much anymore. You can still get simple feature phones, but the fact remains that they don’t sell well, so not many are made, and the ones that are made don’t have a lot of time and money invested in them.
Now Voyager is an extremely simple computer, made with technology that has huge tolerances, in an environment that is mostly consistent and known ahead of time so the design can deliberately account for it, had lots of testing, didn’t have to take mass production into its design consideration, didn’t have to make cost trade-offs, and has a dedicated engineering team to keep it going. It is still impressive that it has lasted this long, but that is more a testament to the incredible work that was and is being put into it than to the technology behind it.
I cant even get a decent wifi signal from a router 15ft away from me, but somehow we’re sending and receiving data from a satellite, that’s practically outside of our solar system. Isn’t that wild?
they do work. my dad still has Nokia phone with black and white screen.
do they still make them like this? i have to buy a new pixel every few years
The satellite dish would press against your hip bone.
I try to diagnose the carburetor in my 50 year old Jeep sitting right in front of me, and I still can’t get it running right.
These people are amazing, and the people that built that so it can still be fixed out in the Oort Cloud were even better.
Anyone ever sometimes think, that there’s an alien species that kinda feels a little paternal towards us and keeps fixing out Tonka Toys because it makes us happy?
Screw thanking aliens, it’s an incredible team of engineers that have the skills and dedication to do what seems impossible. This was 100% humanity at its best.
They rebuilt the most critical core code on a near antique spacecraft that has effectively left the solar system over an equally ancient radio link. They had 1 shot, and nailed it.
Yes ra ra NASA is totally legit and a shining example of the best achievements of humanity for sure. Nothing sketchy about it. It is amazing though to think how manned space flight is the only technology to not only lack progress in the last 60 years, but has actually regressed. I really wish these hero scientists could get back to working on manned space flight so we can ditch this whirling spaceball
Exactly. If there’s anything that we can point to and say “humanity, fuck yeah” this is it. Giving thanks to aliens or to gods is an insult to the hard work of the HUMANS that accomplished this.
Exactly. NASA has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that there is no God, the earth is a ball, we can trust our governments and large institutions, and manned space flight was a '70s trend back when the economy was better. We still have them to thank for Velcro and Tang my dudes
Did they have eeproms in the 70s? It’s just mind blowing. These nerds are next level.
Naw, so Apollo was built with curtain rods and used candles for thrust
https://moon.nasa.gov/system/resources/detail_files/188_detail_as11-40-5927_orig.jpg
This is disrespectful towards the achievements of the human race. My father kept attributing all of our recent technology to “the findings at roswell” and i have very strong feelings towards this position.
So much agreeance. I can see how people may be awestruck by recent technology, but crediting it to extraterrestrial life both completely ignores the gradual progression of knowledge which enabled it and disregards the brilliant minds who spent their lives bringing it to fruition.
Absolute Chad.
Provided we engineer them well, this is good news for truly deep space operations. Cosmic radiation and interplanetary gasses could (and probably do) wreak havoc on various materials, but apparently technology from the 70s is capable of handling it very long term.
Now if we could just get out of these squishy meat suits we’d be in business.
Solid state tech using minerals and metals for interstellar travel.
Squishy meatbag for living and reproducing on a goldilocked planetoid.
We should just turn into comets for the purpose of travelling 🐌 slow but effective
People will believe anything lol