With how china keeps implanting everything with spyware, I agree to keep them away from the heavy tech incorporated cars. Really wish we could transition away from using chinese shit
The whataboutism doesn’t help. It’s a wrong practice regardless of nationality. But since the house and senate is bought by the corporations, at the very least ban those who you can.
It’s not a whataboutism when that’s the other choice. This isn’t out of left field. I can buy Chinese data scraping, Japanese data scraping, Korean data scraping, German data scraping, or American data scraping.
Right now Germany actually wins that contest because GDPR just might have an impact.
A whataboutism would be me talking about American labor practices in farming. Not great, but also not relevant.
All auto manufacturers put spyware in their cars now. This isn’t a china problem, this is an everyone problem. We need anti-spyware laws that apply to everyone.
China is subsidizing EV production and selling cars below cost. Allowing them to be sold in the US would kill the domestic EV market. How is that better for Americans?
For a few years, until the American automakers go bankrupt, as you said, then the Chinese automakers increase prices 10x.
…and the legacy auto industry gets taught a valuable lesson as companies who refused to modernize go bankrupt.
What a valuable lesson, get subsidized by an authoritarian government so that you can offer vehicles below cost. Also be sure to add spyware for the aforementioned authoritarian government.
Do you even understand what below cost means? No amount of modernization will counteract it.
You’re saying “they”, but it’s you. And no you didn’t, repeating what you said before isn’t addressing the issues.
Adressed twice.
Never addressed at all, you pivoted to the oil industry. You didn’t address the subsidies from China or the unfair trade practices.
America will not subsidize to that level, if they could, and no amount of innovation is going to combat subsidization or the unfair trade practices.
According to a Bloomberg article, China will sell EVs at under $10,000, undercutting the price of the average American EV by $50,000. Are you seriously arguing that “investment to lower cost” will reduce the cost by 85-90%? That’s simply a ludicrous assertion.
You think US products won’t have spyware?
I don’t think that collecting anonymized usage data, is the same as unlimited spying going back to an authoritarian government. So no, absolutely nothing comparable.
Then China shouldn’t subsidize its manufacturers’ exports while increasing the burden for foreign companies to compete internally. If anyone thinks China cornering the global EV market is a good long term plan, they are naive.
I don’t see how they’re going to pass the safety regulations here and in the EU. A ton of their ICE vehicles never made it here because they’re dangerously designed and built.
The Volvo EX30 is based on a Geely platform, made in China, and does well in the EU (won several Car of the Year awards).
MG (SAIC/Roewe) also has no trouble selling in the EU.
Chinese manufacturers can make regulatory-conforming cars when the market demands it of them. If the market wants cheap and doesn’t demand safety, they can do that too.
That’s not %100, the EX30 is still engineered and developed in Switzerland and pretty much everything MG wise, was and still, is developed in the UK…yes both are owned by Chinese companies, but it doesn’t mean the products are solely Chinese. You are correct they can build cars that are designed to conform to western markets with much stricter regulations, but I don’t think they’re going to do so without significant input from branches in these countries.
China charges nearly double for its EVs outside of the Chinese market. They tend to do what most companies do, charge the highest price that people will still pay. China domestically is the most competitive market in the world, so they have $10,000 high quality EVs, but they don’t have to do that elsewhere and so they don’t.
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With how china keeps implanting everything with spyware, I agree to keep them away from the heavy tech incorporated cars. Really wish we could transition away from using chinese shit
Oh? More spyware than GM selling your data to your insurance company? More spyware than all of the stuff your smartphone collects?
It’s absolutely a bad faith argument to say we can’t have Chinese cars because they conduct industry standard data scraping.
The whataboutism doesn’t help. It’s a wrong practice regardless of nationality. But since the house and senate is bought by the corporations, at the very least ban those who you can.
It’s not a whataboutism when that’s the other choice. This isn’t out of left field. I can buy Chinese data scraping, Japanese data scraping, Korean data scraping, German data scraping, or American data scraping.
Right now Germany actually wins that contest because GDPR just might have an impact.
A whataboutism would be me talking about American labor practices in farming. Not great, but also not relevant.
All auto manufacturers put spyware in their cars now. This isn’t a china problem, this is an everyone problem. We need anti-spyware laws that apply to everyone.
I agree, but in the meantime lets not make it that easy…
“We want expensive American EVs that most people can’t afford, not cheap Chinese ones…”
China is subsidizing EV production and selling cars below cost. Allowing them to be sold in the US would kill the domestic EV market. How is that better for Americans?
Americans get cheaper EVs and the legacy auto industry gets taught a valuable lesson as companies who refused to modernize go bankrupt.
For a few years, until the American automakers go bankrupt, as you said, then the Chinese automakers increase prices 10x.
What a valuable lesson, get subsidized by an authoritarian government so that you can offer vehicles below cost. Also be sure to add spyware for the aforementioned authoritarian government.
Do you even understand what below cost means? No amount of modernization will counteract it.
Americans can also buy EVs from countries other than China. America can also subsidise internal EV production.
My point is that we shouldn’t give a fuck about petrol loving manufacturers.
Respond to user demand and environmental pressure.
Don’t arrogantly assume your polluting product will remain market leader.
Don’t build ever bigger vehicles just to avoid particular regulations.
Yes. Would you like some oil industry case studies?
Have you heard of R&D investment, continual process improvement and economies of scale?
You’re literally just talking to yourself, ignoring any mention of selling below cost, which is the biggest issue, with spyware being a close 2nd.
They responded
Adressed twice.
Suggesting subsidies should be given to American EV manufacturers
Investing to lower costs.
You think US products won’t have spyware?
You’re saying “they”, but it’s you. And no you didn’t, repeating what you said before isn’t addressing the issues.
Never addressed at all, you pivoted to the oil industry. You didn’t address the subsidies from China or the unfair trade practices.
America will not subsidize to that level, if they could, and no amount of innovation is going to combat subsidization or the unfair trade practices.
According to a Bloomberg article, China will sell EVs at under $10,000, undercutting the price of the average American EV by $50,000. Are you seriously arguing that “investment to lower cost” will reduce the cost by 85-90%? That’s simply a ludicrous assertion.
I don’t think that collecting anonymized usage data, is the same as unlimited spying going back to an authoritarian government. So no, absolutely nothing comparable.
Tell me you know nothing about Chinese EVs without saying you know nothing about Chinese EVs.
Did we lose our industry when the Japanese auto manufacturers entered our market? When the Koreans did?
What’s different this time?
China is becoming an increasingly unreliable trade partner. Preventing them from completely taking over a segment is prudent.
Did he forget to sell his Tesla shares in time?
Something something free market
Then China shouldn’t subsidize its manufacturers’ exports while increasing the burden for foreign companies to compete internally. If anyone thinks China cornering the global EV market is a good long term plan, they are naive.
The US subsidizes american car companies too. Pot calling the kettle and all.
We subsidize exports? Show me.
LMGTFY In August, before the United Auto Workers strike, the Biden administration announced $15.5 billion in funding and loans to help car manufacturers redesign their factories for electric vehicle production.
I don’t see how they’re going to pass the safety regulations here and in the EU. A ton of their ICE vehicles never made it here because they’re dangerously designed and built.
They’re already selling in Europe. To good reviews.
The Volvo EX30 is based on a Geely platform, made in China, and does well in the EU (won several Car of the Year awards).
MG (SAIC/Roewe) also has no trouble selling in the EU.
Chinese manufacturers can make regulatory-conforming cars when the market demands it of them. If the market wants cheap and doesn’t demand safety, they can do that too.
Then the cheap EV’s doesn’t matter if they are not legal.
And the Volvo was not based on Geely. It was the other way around. They bought Volvo for this purpose exactly.
But I hope they will make better EV’s for the world. EV’s are generally just better cars, and it’s a clear road to less noise and toxic pollution.
That’s not %100, the EX30 is still engineered and developed in Switzerland and pretty much everything MG wise, was and still, is developed in the UK…yes both are owned by Chinese companies, but it doesn’t mean the products are solely Chinese. You are correct they can build cars that are designed to conform to western markets with much stricter regulations, but I don’t think they’re going to do so without significant input from branches in these countries.
China charges nearly double for its EVs outside of the Chinese market. They tend to do what most companies do, charge the highest price that people will still pay. China domestically is the most competitive market in the world, so they have $10,000 high quality EVs, but they don’t have to do that elsewhere and so they don’t.
So you admit the cars are better and cheaper?
Translation: Biden doesn’t want fire hazards that take hours and hundreds of gallons to extinguish imported from china.
Chinese EVs are piece of shit death-traps anyway that tend to explode for no reason.
I do t want the Chinese EVs because there falling apart exploding crushing more exploding and.there just not safe
Edit:Sorry about this I get political when I don’t sleep sorry about this
Contrary to teslas that don’t explode and don’t rust. BYD is dominating with affordable EVs while other countries keep prices astronomically high.
Ma’am, do you want me to call 911? you’re exhibiting signs of a stroke.
Sorry I get political when I don’t sleep sorry about that
No need to apologize when it’s true.
they really willing to throw the planet under the bus so they can protect their own oligarchs. so much for the free market.